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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod 6/20)
by Noryungi (noryungi) (noryungi@yahoo.com) on Mon Sep 15 08:23:07 2014 (GMT)
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First of all, many many thanks for your work and for this short introduction!
One obvious question, but which is very important for me, is to know whether or not a portable version of these utilities is planned?
There are still some (sane) Linux distributions that do not plan on shipping with systemd -- porting systembsd under these distros would be a great way to maintain their independence.
How BSD-specific are these utilities? Do you think porting them to Linux would mean significant rewrites?
Second question: apart from logind, how would you rate the difficulty of writing these utilities?
Again, thanks for all the hard work!
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod 5/7)
by ian (128.230.184.88) (ian@kremlin.cc) on Mon Sep 15 17:10:27 2014 (GMT) https://kremlin.cc
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> First of all, many many thanks for your work and for this short introduction!
>
> One obvious question, but which is very important for me, is to know whether or not a portable version of these utilities is planned?
yes, the original outline for the project included a bit about OS-agnosticism. my approach to this was to use GLib overall, so porting it will not be an enormous headache. there are some more fundamental differences (such as how hostnames are handled) that will require a bit more proactive porting effort, however.
i've recently been talking to someone who is interested in working with me + my code to port it to a minimal, busybox-like system which would require stripping out GLib, so that is just another thing on the horizon
> There are still some (sane) Linux distributions that do not plan on shipping with systemd -- porting systembsd under these distros would be a great way to maintain their independence.
>
> How BSD-specific are these utilities? Do you think porting them to Linux would mean significant rewrites?
hostnamed is probably the most bsd-specific right now, localed much less so and timedated even less. logind will probably be more bsd-specific due to the sheer complexity and responsibilities it covers.
> Second question: apart from logind, how would you rate the difficulty of writing these utilities?
i would say about 70% of this project was dealing with all the framework and scaffolding that is D-Bus + friends, which was particularly excruciating at first. even using GDBus (wrapper lib for D-Bus whose first page of documentation has "If you use this low-level API directly, you're signing up for some pain." in bold letters) it was quite a pain to learn, but once you get the hang of it, it is somewhat less of a nightmare.
the other 30% was the actual implementation of the methods on openbsd, which was much less complicated and straightforward. it was the fun part!
> Again, thanks for all the hard work!
you are welcome! :)
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod 2/4)
by Ypnose (134.157.2.73) on Tue Sep 16 07:55:15 2014 (GMT)
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> > Good work. I look forward to see it in base. I'm excited!
>
> This will end up in ports, as protection for systemd-tainted packages.
Yes, true. I did a mistake because I didn't read the entire article. I will read it more carefully next time.
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod 3/3)
by ian (74.106.201.50) (ian@kremlin.cc) on Tue Sep 16 00:46:01 2014 (GMT) https://kremlin.cc
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> Thanks for your work, and for clarifying its limited role in OpenBSD. Any idea how portable this would be to other BSD OSs?
porting to other BSDs will certainly be less of a hassle than porting to linux, and from what i have researched it should be very little trouble overall.
in fact, a freebsd committer (bapt@) has recently begun creating a patch set you can find here: https://people.freebsd.org/~bapt/systembsd/
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod -2/10)
by Lars Schotte (80.152.30.211) (gustik@gustik.eu) on Thu Sep 18 12:34:47 2014 (GMT) http://gustik.eu/
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This replacement utilities to get some software running again may be a good idea. However, I would go further and make the first step towards launchd on BSDs. I already discussed this on a FreeBSD IRC channel and they told me that Apple launchd would be the only choice, because it is Apache licensed and thus license compatible to BSD, unlike other alternatives.
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod -2/2)
by Anonymous Coward (184.71.29.106) on Thu Sep 18 15:34:00 2014 (GMT)
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> This replacement utilities to get some software running again may be a good idea. However, I would go further and make the first step towards launchd on BSDs. I already discussed this on a FreeBSD IRC channel and they told me that Apple launchd would be the only choice, because it is Apache licensed and thus license compatible to BSD, unlike other alternatives.
i don't think its really going places: https://wiki.freebsd.org/launchd
it was a GSoC 2005 project. its 2014.
this is still outside of the scope of the replacement tools talked about here however, they are not and will never replace init.
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Re: GSoC 2014: Systemd replacement utilities (systembsd) (mod -2/2)
by loreb (79.7.204.200) on Thu Sep 18 20:53:12 2014 (GMT)
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> > This replacement utilities to get some software running again may be a good idea. However, I would go further and make the first step towards launchd on BSDs. I already discussed this on a FreeBSD IRC channel and they told me that Apple launchd would be the only choice, because it is Apache licensed and thus license compatible to BSD, unlike other alternatives.
>
> i don't think its really going places: https://wiki.freebsd.org/launchd
> it was a GSoC 2005 project. its 2014.
>
> this is still outside of the scope of the replacement tools talked about here however, they are not and will never replace init.
Does anyone know if http://homepage.ntlworld.com/jonathan.deboynepollard/Softwares/nosh.html was considered/rejected/whatever? While it is meant to replace init it looks modular enough that one could just use a few pieces of it.
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